Ok, I need you to level with me here, PurseBloggers. This particular recap of Real Housewives of DC has politics in it. I don’t like writing about politics any more than you guys like reading about it, but in this instance, I either had to write about gay marriage or post a bunch of LOLCats in the giant chasm that would have been created by omitting the subject from this post. As much as I like LOLCats, that’s not really what I get paid to do.

So if you’d rather avoid political discussion, you won’t hurt my feelings if you skip this one. Also, feel free to disagree, both with me and with each other – we only ask that you do so respectfully. If you’d like to continue reading, you know where to click. If not, we have some lovely posts over at TalkShoes today, and I hope to see you back here next week.

Our episode started with Cat and her husband discussing her book cover, and the casual, intimate photograph Charles wanted to use would have actually been a great choice. Cat liked something that looked less like a real book cover than something a college student would come up with in a publication design class (believe me, y’all, I know of which I speak), and her lack of enthusiasm for his professional opinion eventually degenerated into them talking glumly of his upcoming business trip.

Next, for reasons unbeknownst to anyone but her, Michaele decided to claim that she used to be a Washington Redskins cheerleader. That didn’t pass the truth sniff test for me from the beginning, and yet when she showed up in the stadium’s parking lot to practice for a homecoming (Do they have homecoming in the NFL? That’s the only time we ever had old cheerleaders in college.) routine with other people from her “cheering days,” a few of them seemed to recognize her! Were they paid to recognize her?

Just because people knew who she was, though, doesn’t mean she demonstrated any sort of skill that would seem to indicate prior experience in cheerleading, dance or choreographed group activities of any kind. She also can’t count, which was probably less surprising than it should have been. Someone got so irritated with Michaele’s lack of rhythm mid-routine that she actually stopped and moved her to the periphery so she wouldn’t throw the entire group off the beat. The only thing that Michaele is good at is being blonde.

Luckily we didn’t have to spend too much time with Michaele at Old Lady Cheerleading Camp, because soon it was time for a completely out-of-context ice cream party at Stacie’s house. Was there an explanation for this get-together that I missed, or have we completely dispensed with all attempts to rationally explain why these women have so many forced meetings? Anyway, Cat, Lynda and Mary came and brought their kids, who were completely well-behaved, compared to the adults.

All of the women sat down away from the children to talk about rumors and gossip and gay marriage (ugh, we’ll get to that in a second), and none of them believed that Michaele had ever been a Redskins cheerleader either. Mary brought up the fact that Michaele used to sell her makeup for approximately the 49857894th time, and it still wasn’t relevant – Michaele claimed to have been on the squad in the 80s, Mary knew her in the 90s. Close, but no cigar.

When talk turned to Mary’s daughter quitting her job, Cat had some fairly valid criticisms (as did everyone else in the room), and Erika called Cat mean for the second time in a span of approximately ten minutes. She followed up that outburst by bringing up the whole Tyra Banks kerfuffle from god knows how many episodes ago, and let’s be real here: I don’t like Tyra either. Tyra is crazy, and I don’t know how you could watch more than a couple of seasons of America’s Next Top Model and still think that she’s an admirable, praise-worthy person. She’s repugnant. It’s reality TV, repugnancy is why she’s good at it.

I’ll grant that Cat is annoying on a whole variety of levels and in as many ways as I have fingers for counting, but everyone was sitting around and talking about Lolly living at home and quitting her job, so I’m not sure why Erika chose that moment in particular to get on her Cat The Meanie high horse and bring up Tyra Banks. Cat left the room crying, and considering that we know her marriage was in trouble and her friend had just killed himself during this portion of filming, I probably would have been crying too. Sometimes stuff just piles on.

Speaking of piling on, as Cat was in tears and trying to leave with her children, Erica came back out to “apologize” and then tell her not to stand a certain way or act a certain way or whatever. She had already reduced the woman to tears in front of her children, was that not enough? I know Cat is a loud-mouthed, back-talking, snarky sourpuss. That’s clear to everyone. But that whole scene was unnecessary from every angle, and why was Erika carrying around so much residual Tyra rage? Does she have a hidden shrine to Ty-Ty in her closet? Someone go check, I bet she does.

Next, it was time for Mary’s family to display its various flaws and problems, and as always, they revolved around Lolly. Lolly quit her job because the warm glow of her new desk and business cards suddenly wasn’t enough for her when she realized that she would be required to do actual work in order to take home a paycheck, and she wanted to stay home for a bit longer to save up more money. Mary’s husband wasn’t all that psyched about letting Lolly hang around for longer while she tried to make it as an artist instead of having a real job, but Mary was fine with letting Lolly stay while she communed with her paintbrushes or whatever it was she was planning to do.

LAST CHANCE IF YOU WANT TO BAIL OUT BEFORE POLITICS

From parenting issues to marriage issues, most of the cast and their satellite friends got together to talk to a DC city councilman about gay marriage for reasons that were never made entirely clear (and we all know that when the reasons aren’t entirely clear, it’s because the whole thing was a producer’s idea). The housewives were very split on the issue, and surprisingly, Stacie and Jason were against gay marriage. They were okay with civil unions, and apparently semantics are very important to them.

Naturally, Paul took serious offense at their stance and wondered if he should still be friends with them, and it was just uncomfortable and awkward all around. Mary said she didn’t really care about it because it didn’t affect her, which Paul also found odd (and so did I) – some of her dearest friends are gay, and she’s had no problem parading them around on this show for extra camera time. Shame on her for reaping the benefits of the gay bestie without having concern for how the world treats her friends.

In a later dinner, Stacie admitted that she knows “separate but equal” is never really equal, and yet she still seemed a bit…what’s the word…grossed out over the whole subject. Lynda, who continues to surprise me in ways that are in turn either delightful or horrifying, hit one out of the park with me by putting semantics aside and supporting marriage equality wholeheartedly, in spite of her conservative upbringing and personal sexuality.

I don’t even have anything particularly insightful or funny to say about that whole conversation, except that it disappointed me to hear Stacie and Jason, two people whom I have enjoyed very much so far, espouse that particular opinion and compare being called a homophobe for not supporting gay marriage to being harassed on the street with slurs just for being a gay man in public. (Those two things? Not comparable.) The entire week, I had been hoping against hope that their comments in the previews for the episode had been taken out of context; alas, they were not. Bravo has dashed my hopes once again. Why must they toy with me so? I certainly don’t think they’re bad people because of their politics, but I can’t deny feeling a bit let down.

Luckily, all of these people would rather talk about each other than about political issues, so the conversation quickly turned to Mary and Stacie gently reprimanding Erica at dinner for attacking Cat inappropriately at Stacie’s party. At a separate meeting, Lynda and Paul also talked about Cat and how her personality has changed since her husband has been away for business. Not only was it refreshing to see people identify inappropriate behavior and address it as such, but Lynda and Paul both managed to by sympathetic and sensitive about the things that might be making Cat particularly abrasive. Nuance? Empathy? ARE THESE ALIEN HOUSEWIVES?

Just when people were seeming fallible and reasonable and maybe even a little bit tolerable, the producers brought out Michaele and her Pom Poms of Insanity again to talk about being a cheerleader and a “brick house” and needing boobs to “finish” her. Some mention was also made of butt implants, but at that point I had completely glazed over in the face of such idiocy and was no longer able to process sentences or create thoughts.

And then, things just got worse. Or better, depending on how you look at it. The Salahis were meeting with their, uh, delegate to lobby him about some kind of new legal restrictions on family wineries, and Michaele intimated that they could possibly go bankrupt. Again. They were already bankrupt? Where’s the story on that? Now that is something I’d read.

Back at Mary’s house, Mary managed to redeem herself a little bit on gay marriage by admitting that she shouldn’t have said that gay marriage doesn’t effect her in any way. Lolly, much to my surprise, spoke about the issue eloquently and fairly, and also schooled her mom a little bit. I’m tempted to make fun of Mary for not being able to quote from the Constitution, but let’s be honest – I’m guessing most people can’t.

That’s not where discussion of the issue ended, though. Cat and the other Jason (the gay-married one) got together to have a cocktail and talk about his future desires to foster GLBT kids. Can Jason and his husband get a reality show? Please? That would be great. From there, the subject quickly changed to Cat’s hate for her neighborhood, and we found out that she lives in the suburbs instead of within the Washington, D.C. She feels isolated and alone out there, and it must be a big change from running around London. I’ve never met a suburb that I wanted to spend much time in, and if she’s from another country and doesn’t know many people, it must be particularly isolating. From being a clear villain at the beginning of the season, Cat seems to be making something of a sympathetic comeback. As it turns out, Real Housewives redemption apparently does exist. Just as Alex McCord.

We went straight from the practical concerns of location and friendship to things that aren’t even rooted in reality – the Salahis wanted to write a book. Well, “write.” They met with a writer to discuss the details of having the book written for them, and they wanted to call it Wine, War and Roses. Gag. Tareq’s main concern was making sure that they found a publisher who would give them an advance, of course. They discussed the story a bit, and Michaele emphasized the importance of making sure that the story had a happy ending. Nevermind the fact that the story was supposed to be true – The Awful Twins are so far removed from objective reality that neither of them would know the truth if it punched them in their throats.

Share Your Thoughts With Us

  • suz

    I can’t watch this dreck anymore. But, I still read your recaps and continue to admire your ability to make lemonade out of lemons.

  • suz
  • Jo Marie

    Yes. Perhaps Michelle (and let’s be real, she is not Michaela), attended a cheer-leader workshop, open to the paying public. You are totally on the money about the delusions the Salahis operate from. How they both manage to stay ahead of criminal fraud charges is beyond me.
    I think Stacy is coming around on the marriage issue. It is a civil rights issue and I don’t believe she’s a hypocrite, just needs to connect the dots. Mary will also see the light and it would be nice to see her spread out a little and embrace another cause.
    I also think Cat should be taken aside and educated on the assumption people must have that if she reserves the right to say exactly what she feels is the truth in rudely abrasive tones the assumption is that this is a form of communication that she condones and values. She can’t get all personally wounded when people address her outside the bounds of perfect, traditional civility without appearing ridiculous.
    Linda has my respect. Talks the talk and walks the walk.
    And of course I would march in the streets of DC as Paul’s champion in a heartbeat.

  • PhotoGirl

    Excellent recap.

    Good heavens! Where to begin? Michaele does a disservice to Aging Cheerleaders everywhere. (Yes, I speak from experience.) She never ceases to amaze.

    I’ve never been a fan of Cat’s, but I thought Erika’s behavior was absolutely uncalled for. If that had happened in my home, I would have put a swift end to it. I am astonished that Stacie, with all of her concern for doing the “right” thing, did not. I really felt badly for Cat. Clearly, Erika is auditioning to be the next DC housewife. Given the DC group’s relatively high level of civility (as far as this franchise goes) I’m imagining that she has a fighting chance. The Salahis are clearly not trashy enough to satisy Bravo’s extremely low taste and decency standards, but Erika just might be. She’d be a perfect fit for the ATL group, I think.

    As for the elephant in the room, I am very put off by the ease with which Stacie and Jason can deny gay people their civil rights. I respect their right to their opinion, but I’m disappointed just the same. I agree with Paul’s thought that perhaps they should not be his friends. Some issues are simply deal breakers. (I’ve read that Paul is getting his own show. Does anyone know whether or not this is true? I’d watch!)

    BTW, I don’t care for Tyra, either. I liked her much more when she simply walked the catwalk and kept her mouth shut.

  • LOVE LV

    This show is rather strange — I don’t see the connection between any of these women, why are they ‘friends’? It’s just politics,,,, rub my back and will scratch yours. I guess that’s what these women represent. Their is no genuine caring with the exception of Stacie and her loving husband. I love them! I guess the shows message was that you need to go along to get along even if that means compromising your own values.

  • Matthew

    During the day I’m a non-profit GLBT arts administrator, and I typically watch RH to escape real life. Thus it was somewhat of a surprise to see the good fight of my life playing out on TV before my very eyes. Not that I’m complaining. It was refreshing to see them deal with some REAL issues, as opposed to whether or not someone should eat a cheeseburger or can cheer for the Redskins.

    I would argue, Amanda, that the discussion of gay marriage is not politics. At least not in terms of the civil discourse between Democrats and Republicans. It is, however, a discussion of civil rights. It’s also a “political” discussion, but not the same as talking about Obama and Bush, a la last week.

    I don’t find Stacie to be that far off course. I have long argued that the government should walk the walk and separate themselves from religion. Marriage is a religious institution; government is civil, thus: Government should issue civil unions to all couples, gay and straight, and let the churches decide whom to marry.

    Stacie doesn’t have a problem with gay unions, so to speak, but she can’t seem to rectify the issue of marriage and it being between a man and a woman. This isn’t about politics; it’s about religion. So take religion out of government for all couples, and let the churches decide on their own.

    One final point: if you’re religious and your religion is making you feel that civil rights is somehow “wrong,” shouldn’t that make you take pause about your religion?

    P.S. Lolly, get a job…but mad props to you on your stance on this issue and your knowledge of the Constitution. Color me impressed! Now go use that knowledge and insight for something productive.

    • You know, I agree with you wholeheartedly. I don’t think it’s a “political” issue either, I think it’s a pretty basic right and it should transcend politics. I wish that it wasn’t politicized or used as a tool to rally people for or against one party or the other. It’s a shame that it is, and it’s a shame that it’s being used as a plot device for a silly reality show about shallow people and their personality problems. In a way, I guess it’s not bad that it gets a discussion of the issue going among people who might not talk about it otherwise, but still – the show’s handling of the issue left me with a not-so-great taste in my mouth.

      • Matthew

        I understand what you’re saying, but you know, I’ll never argue with any form of media fighting the battle for gay rights. I realize this show is trashy – and probably in this sense preaching to the choir – but anytime we can get something out there on national TV explaining the lack of civil rights for gay individuals, I’ll take it.

      • I just wish the discussion had been a little more eloquent. What Paul said was great (and important for people to hear who may not have openly gay friends), and Lynda was surprisingly sensitive on the topic, but…I don’t know, maybe the housewives just automatically put a bad taste in my mouth, no matter the subject. I hate to see issues I care about get run through the Bravo sausage machine, but I see what you’re saying and I don’t necessarily disagree.

      • Matthew

        This is in reply to your second reply, which is in reply to my reply, which is…never mind!

        Anyway, I think Paul’s reaction was sort of knee-jerk. It’s not as if Stacie and Jason railed against homosexuality or anything like that. They are just uncomfortable with the marriage (see: semantics) idea, and need some time to warm up to it. The only way that will happen is with education, experience, and time. Paul owes it to himself and the gay community to work with them on that, and as you said, I believe they’ll come around.

        As far as eloquence, I though that Lynda and Lolly (shocking) were by far the most eloquent about the entire issue. Cat had a predictable response, which was almost refreshing in and of itself, because she just didn’t understand why it was an issue for so many people. And Mary started off being ignorant but eventually realized it’s something about which she should be more passionate.

        I’m sure Michaele would be pro-gay marriage, but she’s so vapid, would anyone even notice?

        Lastly, being a gay man, do you think Andy Cohen cares more about whatever generates ratings for RH, good, bad, or indifferent…OR do you think he cares more about the gay issues that played out on TV last night? I would like to think it’s the latter, but I think it’s the former. And if the latter happens, that’s just a bonus to him. Call me cynical.

  • Bagolicious

    Well, what a train wreck of an episode last night. As for Stacie and Jason, it didn’t surprise me, in the least bit, that they didn’t jump on the gay marriage bandwagon. It’s all tied up with their religious beliefs, as it is with a lot of people in this country.

    As for the Erika and Cat fight, Erika was way out of line to start up the Cat fight at Stacie’s party. It was not the time or the place for such. But, then again, Cat, the mean girl, can dish it, but she can’t take it. And Cat, has more than once, been VERY inappropriate with her comments and behavior at different venues.

    And as for Paul maybe not being friends with those who aren’t in favor of gay “marriage”, well, really. I have friends who have different opinions than I have about various important issues. As for gay marriage rights, I have no beef with gays getting married, and most of my friends don’t have any beef with it, but there are some friends that are opposed to the word, “marriage”. So, it’s back to semantics.

    And I have some gay friends, who aren’t on the gay marriage bandwagon and some have been in committed relationships for nearly two decades. Everyone doesn’t think alike. All gays don’t think alike as well as all Black people don’t think alike. But, the bottom line is that we are all still friends, just with different views. Plus, it’s kind of difficult to get friends, who oppose a concept, to possibly eventually see the light, if you’re no longer friends with them.

    I have a best male friend, who’s ex-girlfriend’s father hated Black males. So, that put him in a very difficult position. But, he didn’t get mad at the girl’s father. He said that he was just going to just kill him with kindness. And that’s exactly what he did. And the man turned around, with TIME, and even apologized to my friend.

    My friend was always included in ALL family gatherings and was also treated like a son, both before and long after my friend and the girl had broken up. My friend was also with the ex-girlfriend’s father on his death bed. They became very close. And to this day, nearly three decades later, he and the entire family are close and he’s even godfather to the ex-girlfriend’s first born. I know the family and they are a very nice family.

    So, all of this, I’m not going to be friends with you stuff, because you don’t believe what I believe, to me is bunk. Sometimes it takes TIME and PATIENCE to try to bring people around. But, then again, this is the microwave generation. And Paul, as a Black male, should know that the Civil Rights movement and the changes that came out of it didn’t happen overnight and neither will the changes in the Gay Marriage movement.

    And as for Mary and her comment about the whole gay marriage issue not affecting her, well such a comment, and a lot of her comments, don’t surprise me as I find her just ditzy. It’s good she had a daughter who could explain it to her.

    As for Lolly coming back home, as far as I’m concerned, she shouldn’t have been allowed to come back home. Grow up, get a real job, and support your adult behind! I’m sick and tired of whining, can’t- make- it- in- the- big- world 20-somethings. Life and making it in life is hard, but you just deal with it and do it. It was no picnic for my generation either.

    Such whininess was unheard of in my generation. You left home at 18, went off to either university, work, or the military, and made it on one’s own. That’s what my siblings and I did, along with the majority of our friends. Off to university we went. And if you later came home, it was to help out a parent or grandparent, due to circumstances such as sickness or divorce, but even then you absolutely didn’t live rent free. You contributed money, monthly, to the household to help out. Then when things in the household were better, you moved on. But, you didn’t come back as a couch potato living off of the parents in order to buy time to find one’s self. In my generation you would have found yourself out on the street because parents wouldn’t have had it. But, that’s what made us strong and independent.

    • Nat

      oh my god, get over yourself!
      hahahahahahhahah

  • Bagolicious

    Correction: “He said that he was just going to kill him with kindness”. My eyes and typing just keep on getting worse. LOL!

  • Ellen

    First of all, how is it possible that the evil twins haven’t picked up on the fact that they are the laughing stocks of the city, (and now the entire viewing audience)? They seem to live in their own little reality. I am dying to see the party crash next week! Michaele is looking more and more Stepford Wife every week! She kind of scares me with her big eyes, frozen smile, and all those bones sticking out.
    I did feel badly for Cat at the ice cream party. What is with Erika? “Meowwww”. She is workin’ her 15 minutes for sure! Poor Stacie. She should find new friends.
    The whole political discussion was uncomfortable, and out of place. You know what they say about religion and politics.
    I simply cannot take these vacuous people any more! They are so out of touch with reality that there should be a new television genre called “Alternate Reality TV”. You could probably substitute monkees for these morons, and not tell the difference. Bravo: PLEASE put us out of our misery!!

    Although, I am kind of looking forward to the RH of Beverly Hills. Anything that happens in California seems to be over the top and juicy!

  • Bagolicious

    Ellen: The Beverly Hills show will probably be quite interesting, And I’m sure I’ll have a lot to say about it as I’m from L.A. and have been among a lot of Beverly Hills types over the decades. LOL!

  • Lisa in Oregon

    I’m in complete agreement with Matthew, in that if your religion somehow “dictates” that you must refuse another of their civil rights, you should take another look at said religion. Not to start a debate about religious beliefs, but I feel in this case, Stacie recognizes the hypocrisy. I do not believe Stacie is a hypocrite, but rather (like Jo Marie) she is in the process of connecting the dots. I truly hope she will get there.

    Thank you Amanda, for yet another amazing recap!

    • I think you’re right about Stacie. It can be incredibly difficult when your conscience tells you one thing and your chosen religious leader is telling you the opposite, and that seems to be the predicament in which Stacie has found herself. Religion is so incredibly important in the day-to-day lives and lifestyles of so many people that I imagine it would be very difficult to find a sticking point like gay marriage that makes you wonder about the guidance you’re receiving, and I think it’s interesting that Erika and Stacie go to the same church but Erika seems to support marriage equality. I would imagine that, no matter what religion you have or which place of worship you attend, there will be always be issues over which you disagree with your priest, preacher, rabbi, etc. I think Stacie will come around.

  • gpc

    I just can’t understand why Mary always wears something around her neck. All I can think of when I see her is some haunted house ghost who was decapitated in their former life and comes back wearing a scarf around their neck to cover the scar…

  • Nat

    I’d like to know why do you take your time to write about these kind of things. Let’s talk about bags!

    • Ellen

      Not “MANBAGS”! You know you want one!

    • Matthew

      Lest I offend anyone, I was completely joking, based entirely off the other conversations going on on here.

    • Because it’s fun and people like it, which is pretty clear from the number of comments. There’s plenty to read on this site if you just want to read about handbags and nothing else.

      • c.c.

        I do enjoy your posts.

        Not only are they entertaining, I enjoy hearing someone else’s perspective since no one I know watches the Bravo shows.

        Don’t know if you come back to the comments, but another point about Stacie/Cat/Tyra.

        It’s not that Cat didn’t like Tyra. That wasn’t the issue for me. The issue I had was her lack of respect for the hostess. She was invited to someone’s house. The Chef worked for and obviously liked Tyra. It was rude to say anthing about her.

        It was made even worse by the fact that Cat tried to imitate Tyra with a voice that sounded like Mammy from Gone With the Wind. Really, really tasteless to imitate a black person with a fake black accent (for lack of a better word) to a bunch of African American women.

        It would be like me imitating a hillbilly accent around southern people. They would be offended. And rightly so because they don’t sound that way.

        I think that’s why Erica was so angry. My take.

  • cathy

    it’s the Declaration of Independence that was “quoted”, not the Constitution

    • That was sort of part of the joke…they should have been referring to the Constitution, since the Declaration doesn’t have anything to do with how laws or made or rights are protected. But they’re Housewives, so…not so much.

      Hey, not all the jokes are good ones.

      • NCGal

        I got it, ‘Manda, thought it was a good one, too!

  • D

    Why does Erika hold such contempt for Cat to the point where she is behaving like a child? Really Erika, if a woman is annoying you so much, turn the cheek and ignore it.

    As for the whole gay marriage issue, I think Stacie & Jason are probably more conflicted over the issue simply because they are parents of very young children.

    Mary needs to seriously change her attitude with Lolly. She is more concerned about her closet being breached then she is about her daughter making her way in life on her own 2 feet. Very nice of her to support her artistic endeavors but really, how is the girl going to earn a paycheck? How can Lolly stay there and save up some more $ without a job?

    Amanda, this week I didn’t find your recap to be political at all….thanks!!!

    • Matthew

      What do young children have to do with the whole gay marriage issue? When my partner and I adopt or have a baby through a surrogate, we’ll have a young child.

  • Bagolicious

    Matthew: I was wondering the same. What do young children have to do with it?

  • Bagolicious

    Nat: Get over yourself!

  • carla

    Gay rights are even more important to me having young children. I want them to grow up in a world where people are free to marry whomever they want. But I suppose people like Jason (more so then Stacie, I think) would not for one second entertain the idea that it might be THEIR child that turns out to be gay.

    The outside of Stacie’s house looks like one of those miniature houses you put around a train track.

    Is Lolly her real name or is it short for something?

  • D

    Mathew & Bagolicious:

    I merely meant that having young children means they would have to explain to their kids, a culture different from their own which they don’t know much about.

    As a parent of very young children, I just don’t know how I’m going to explain the gay marriage issue to them. I am not saying I am for or against the topic, I just don’t know enough about it to clearly explain it to them.

    For those of you who do not have kids – well you need to know that kids ask a LOT of questions and they can bring up the same questions weeks after having a discussion about something, seemingly out of the clear blue sky. Not to mention, they will wait until you are on line at the supermarket to ask. So, a parent needs to be prepared as best they can on how to answer those questions – if they don’t know the answers themselves it makes the conversation/explanations very difficult.

    I’m actually thankful for this episode because it has made me aware that I need to seriously spend some time with my hubby and talk about how we are going to discuss this with the kids.

    Please don’t bash me for not being completely informed on the issue. Shows like this are merely bringing some important issues to the mainstream audience and opening up what I feel are very good dialogues.

    So, I’m just saying that maybe that’s where Stacie & Jason are coming from….someone else mentioned they could hold their views based upon their religion. That too could also be true, I don’t know.

    I just don’t feel it is beneficial to the debate of “for or against gay marriage” when you shut people out simply for having an initial point of view one way or the other. I was honestly surprised that Paul would question whether he could continue to be friends with them for having their opinions.

    By the way Mathew, I think it is terrific that you plan on having a child.

    Lastly, don’t attack me a-la Erika. Stacie seemed to be the most down to earth person on the show & I was just trying to stick up for her after she has taken a beating for her statement.

    Hey, did anyone else catch a statement from Cat’s husband when he was explaining his travel itinerary, that he had to stop over in London for his brother’s Wedding???? Why wasn’t he taking his wife and the kids to his bro’s wedding?

    • Matthew

      I’m sorry if you felt I was attacking you. I wasn’t trying to. I do agree with Bagolicious, however, that the more nonchalant and normal acting you are about a circumstance, the less of a deal it will be with children.

      I’m personally excited because I’ll be an uncle for the first time in January. And plenty of my cousins are having children right now too. So they see my partner and me on a regular basis, and it’s really not an issue at all for the kids. They see us together just like they see other couples together. I don’t know what they ask their parents when I’m not around, but I doubt it’s much of an issue to them.

      And my brother and sister-in-law are excited to have gay uncles to spoil their child. :-)

      I do have one aunt and her husband who are not supportive of my relationship, for religious reasons, but it doesn’t impact the children because most people probably wouldn’t let them say anything negative to a child about it.

      The more gay issues are normalized, through personal relationship, television shows, articles, etc., the more normal it will be for everyone, parents and children alike.

  • Bagolicious

    D: No one was bashing or attacking you. It was a mere question of what young children had to do with the gay marriage issue. It was a puzzling statement to me, as it obviously was to Matthew. Now, it’s been clarified as to what you meant.

    I personally know a lot of people with kids whether straight or gay and as far as their kids go, they have just explained to them that some kids have two mothers and some have two fathers and that’s been basically it. And since they have both gay and straight friends, and the kids regularly see different marital/relationship combinations, it doesn’t seem anymore strange to the kids, than it would to kids who are around other races. It’s about exposure to those different from oneself.

    Plus, most of the gay couples that my friends and I know, have nieces, nephews, cousins, etc…and other kids in their extended families. So, it’s natural for those kids to be around their gay relatives and partners. If there’s a problem with the situation, it’s usually not the kids who are having a problem with it, but it’s the adults who are.

    I remember when one of my grandparents explained about gay people to me back in the early 60s. She and my grandfather had a good male friend who we all knew was gay. It was a lot more difficult for gay people then. She explained it to me and I was fine with it. And she and my grandfather were both religious people, but they treated everyone equally.

    As far as the part where you stated that someone else mentioned that Stacy and Jason could hold their views based upon their religion, well, I was the one who mentioned it. It seems evident to me that it’s based on a combination of religion and semantics.

    And as for those who wonder why a blog should be written on this show and this and other topics, brought up on the show, well, it’s pretty evident to me that it’s serving a positive purpose in bringing once buried topics to the surface and creating an awareness.

  • Aja

    Everyone needs to lay off Lolly. If someone lives at home with their parents, it is no one’s business but that person and their parents. People that hate on twenty somethings for living at home and saving money, always end up sounding a bit jealous.

    • Matthew

      It’s no one’s business but theirs, until they put it on national TV.

    • Lisa

      I agree, I lived at home until I was 32, mind you I was working the whole entire time to save up plenty of money to buy my own home and did so graciously with a big down payment and I thank God for my parents everyday, I’m now 42. Mary was able to go back home with her baby and her husband so her husband should be even more acceptable than her!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • NCgal

      No, you are missing the point. We are reacting to parents who, for selfish reasons (ego, guilt, lonliness, etc.) allow their adult children to remain dependant for too long. They cannot stand for their children to fail, make mistakes and under the banner of “help” hobble them by always allowing them an escape route.

  • Bagolicious

    Aja: I’m not hating on 20-year olds who live with their parents. It’s interesting on how things get twisted around on forums. I’m speaking to those couch potato 20-year olds and sometimes 30-year olds who just won’t permanently leave the nest and get out and make it on their own two feet. And in my line of work, I constantly hear parents complaining about their 20 and 30 somethings who are still lying around the house or leaving and constantly coming back. So, I simply ask those parents why they allow it? I then ask them if their parents would have allowed it with them and the answer is overwhelmingly that their parents would not have allowed it.

    And as for the end of your above statement of, “……always end up sounding jealous”. Jealous of what? I’m one who has been standing on my own two feet since right out of university in the late 70s.

    As for Lolly living with her parents again and saving up money, as “D” wrote above, “How can Lolly stay there and save up some $ without a job.” I agree with “D” on that one.

    And as Matthew has said above, “It’s no one’s business but theirs, until they put it on national TV”.

    As for anyone’s business, none of this is any of our business, but it’s on national TV, so we therefore comment on it. You put the stuff out there on national TV and it’s going to be commented on. And from what I remember of the episode, I don’t think Lolly’s father was too thrilled about her coming back home. So, he obviously gets it.

    • Jo Marie

      Trust Fund

  • Bagolicious

    And I agree with Amanda, on her paragraph above, about Lolly quitting her job. That’s what I was speaking to.

  • adrienne z

    I know i’m going to get bombasted for this, but i’m going to say it anyway.
    If Stacie and Jason are not into the gay marriage thing, that is their perogative. If gays want their opinions respected, then they should respect other peoples’ opinions as well and leave it at that.
    I personally could care less what other people do. I just don’t think it’s necessary to cram their lifestyles, opinions, and activities down my throat. I don’t share my personal life with anyone. It is, quite simply, none of anybody’s business. Period. As is anyone else’s life to me. I could care less. I don’t embrace a gay lifestyle and never will and don’t like all of the force-feeding that is going on over the past twenty years. That’s my opinon and I’m entitled to it. If other people want to embrace that lifestyle, that’s fine too. I would just prefer that it stays private where it belongs and doesn’t need advertising. Some of us really don’t care to know and/or want to do anything about it.
    If Paul decides all of a sudden that he doesn’t want to be friends with people that up until this point he loved, cherished, respected, and had fun with because their opinions differ from his, the HE is the bigot and his friendship was fake to begin with. Nobody needs to change for anybody else. Just do your own thing and shut the heck up. It’s when people start arguing their point and try to change other peoples’ opinions for their own personal gain or ego is when the problems start and escalate into bigger issues.

    • Matthew

      It’s not about my ego or trying to push my opinions down your throat. I’ve been in a loving, monogamous relationship for over seven years, but because we live in a state that doesn’t recognize gay relationships, we are essentially second class citizens. It’s about equal rights. As a gay American, I just want the same rights you have. That’s all.

      • adrienne z

        i wasn’t talking about Your ego. I was speaking in generalities; parades, public announcements, “coming outs”, advocates, demonstrations etc. Why does a good majority of the gay community have to Announce everything? Why can’t gay people just be gay and be happy in their relationships? Why can’t people have their relationships in private? Why do I need to know anything about other peoples’ lifestyles? I don’t care about anybody else. I have my own life to live, my own schedule, my own set of problems, and my own business to tend to. I don’t need to know who is having sex with who.l I don’t care.
        Even the fact that this meeting on this reality show put on by Bravo is a way of pushing thier gay advocate rights on us. I do not need to opine on the plight of two people of the same sex wanting to marry each other and not being able to. Bravo and all other networks are pushing gay rights and blatant homosexuality. This generation of kids are growing up thinking this is the way all men are supposed to act. I’m sure alot of people are happy with that and think it’s fine for everyone to think that homosexuality is the norm, but I’m a product of the 60’s when married couples on TV were not even allowed to be shown sharing the same bed. I have a problem with this “anything goes” society and attitude and am convinced it is contributing heavily to the plummeting downfall of this country.
        Don’t get me wrong, Please! I do not hate gay people at all. I watch Andy Cohen faithfully – I think he’s hilarious! I watch Flipping Out and Project Runway every time it’s on. I think Paul on this show is adorable (but he shouldn’t dislike friends he’s had for years because they have a different opinion – had they never had that meeting – it wouldn’t even be a problem!) I have friends who are in same sex relationships that I love dearly and respect. I’m happy when they are happy, but when the gay society is “pushing themselves” on people just to be known, I start having a problem with the hornblowers as a whole. When you put a transvestite in a kids movie (Shrek) – I think that is going Whay too far.
        You are fortunate to be in a loving relationship. That’s what makes life worth living. Good luck to you and glad you enjoy the RH series as do I. They are fun and it’s a nice break from real reality.

      • Matthew

        I’m not going to change your mind on this. I won’t try. We’ll just have to agree to disagree. :-)

        All I would ask is that you consider the issues beyond what you see on TV or in the movies, or in the Pride parades, or wherever else…because if my partner were to be dying in the hospital, there is no guarantee that I could be at his side in the state in which I reside.

        In my state, I’m not considered part of his family, and the hospital could very easily turn me away.

        I just want the same rights a heterosexual married couple have.

    • Jo Marie

      We are discussing an issue that will allow people to do exactly as you are doing. At this time it is only possible for people who feel exactly as you feel, heterosexual, to live as they choose. Once these rights are universal the discussion will no longer be so strident .

      • Lisa in Oregon

        Exactly. When Adrienne asks “Why does a good majority of the gay community have to Announce everything? Why can’t gay people just be gay and be happy in their relationships? Why can’t people have their relationships in private?” The answer is simple, because they do not enjoy the same civil rights that you and I enjoy.

    • c.c.

      Your entitled to you opinion of course, so I won’t comment on anything you said. Your post just strikes me as a little angry.

      Where I live and the type of work I do, I’m surrounded by gay people. In fact they probably outnumber straight people if I think about it.

      I can honestly say no one has ever tried to cram anything down my thought. In fact, it’s never really talked about. We talk about the same things I talk to straight people about- how jobs suck, shopping, money, relationships, etc. The same things any people talk about.

      I’m wondering who all these gay people are that are trying to cram things down your throat?
      I’m around gay people daily and it never happens to me.

    • NCGal

      I am product of the 50’s Adrienne, so please don’t hide behind an era as a defense for prejudice. You do realize, don’t you that this is EXACTLY what people used to say about women (pre-suffragettes), what they used to say in the early 50’s about non-whites pre- civil rights…same thing people used to say about Irish, Chinese, Polish, Italian, immigrants in the ’20s, what Americans post-WWII used to say about the 1st generation Jews from Eastern Europe. ANYtime a group of people are in any way subjugated or marginalized, then it is imperative that there be CEASELESS, strident, loud, in-your-face confrontation. THAT is how policy and laws are passed. So, when you cite the downfall of our nation as being the of an “anything goes” attitude, try telling that to a black man, a black woman, a Jew, Hispanic, Asian, gay, straight, or lesbian. What we know is that the real reason for our “downfall” (if we are indeed having one) is because of unmitigated greed, unconscious exploitation, a general lack of media literacy, and just plain old arrogance and fear. The only people I know that ever say what you said above are people who feel they are impervious to judgement, invulnerable and can therefore sit back and judge. I was taught that, because of my privilege, I am honor-bound to fight for the rights of all people and not rest on my laurels, that when one person is persecuted for their religion, race, creed, color or sexual orientation, and is allowed to do so unchecked, we are ALL vulnerable.

      • Jo Marie

        BRAVO!

      • Lisa in Oregon

        Excellent!! VERY well said!!

      • Matthew

        Thank you!

  • c.c.

    I guess Cat’s finally learning what my son learned in the 5th grade. There are repercussions for your actions. When you open your big yap and try to be edgy and outspoken trying to get a little camera time what you say might come back to bite you in the butt. Oh well.

    Funny how people that love to be so outspoken sure don’t like it when it happens to them.

    Stacie is an idiot. Granted, she’s a wealthy Harvard (I think) educated idiot but she’s an idiot regardless.

  • Bagolicious

    NCgal: You hit the nail right on the head! It could not have been said any better. Kudos! And that’s exactly what I have been talking about.

  • helen

    Sorry – saw the pic of the Salahis and had to skip. (ipad)

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